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1/350 Fujimi IJN Kongo Build Log/ Review
Clanky44
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Posted: Sunday, October 19, 2008 - 02:52 PM GMT+7
Hi Dade,

Good start with the painting, the deck looks great and has one big advantage,... not having to mask the wood!

Frank
Karybdis
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Posted: Sunday, October 19, 2008 - 03:01 PM GMT+7
I know I sound like a broken record, but I can't thank you guys enough for all the nice words- they really mean a lot to me.

Mark, when you see the final shots with studio lighting and everything, I think you'll like what you see. These pictures really don't do the build justice, but that'll be rectified at the end stage.


Rui, thanks!


Steve, I'm gonna quote (with some modifiers) most of what I've said before regarding sealing. I was going to use Thompson's Water Seal, but that may change. I'll be visiting my father this week (a retired carpenter, modeler, and the man who makes my bases)- he has some different sealing products that I want to look at. I'll make a report on my results when I get back.

It's not that the model is going outside or that I want the piece shiny. It's that without proper sealing, glue can play havoc with thin wood. The glue can soak into the wood and during the expanding/ contracting process that all wood goes through, can cause thin wood to crack or break. Thin wood can very much be affected by an indoor environment- humidity levels in the air and such. And this is where it gets very key: over the years, without sealing, the wood can become discolored and distorted just from indoor humidity and temperature.

Here's the second part to the whole thing: I plan on putting a light wash over my deck to bring out the details between the planking. Without sealing, the wash will just soak into the wood and discolor the entire thing. It HAS to be sealed to keep the wash tight and the wood's color correct.

I've built paper models and without fail, sealing is always recommended. Since Shinsengumi's decks are paper thin and are basically the same material (paper in fact is actually more weather resistant than thin wood), I would much rather play it safe with my almost $100 dollar investment.

As for the wood getting glossy, I honestly don't mind, because I always, always, always put a dull coat seal over everything. It protects the paint, the wash, decals, and in this case also, the wood. The Gunze paint that I'm using is all glossy and semi-gloss (not to mention the washes will make it shiny too), so a dull coat's gonna be needed anyway. So what's a few extra passes to dull down the wood? My entire process of sealing, wash, dullcoat, will be photographed and posted here to follow along with, so no worries.


Kenny, you're exactly right about it helping arthritic hands. I'm 35, but have had arthritis since I was 12. Both of my wrists are fused (rods in one, plate in another) and I only have the use of five fingers total (forefinger, middle, thumb on left; fore and thumb on right), the rest of my fingers are curled in and useless. So I've had to come up with workarounds for a lot of things and this little mod helps a ton! It's not pretty, but I really recommend it- your airbrush work will be much more enjoyable.


D.T., yes, I've always wondered why airbrush makers have never made different length triggers. It seems like such an easy idea and I think many people would like to have the trigger adapted to their needs. After all, the trigger is nearly all of the control of the brush, so why not make it comfortable to use?


Frank, that lack of masking is absolutely right. If I could get a wood deck (or even a pre-cut linoleum decal for those who have linoleum) for all my ships, I would be overjoyed! Hours of tedium are saved with these things.

Thanks again to everybody- back to work for me (preparing the hundreds of tiny vents, binoculars, etc.).
Karybdis
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Posted: Monday, October 20, 2008 - 08:34 PM GMT+7
One of the nice things about this kit is the fact that Fujimi didn't simply mold all of the vents, etc. on to the deck. This makes it much easier to paint and prepare the deck because all of those things don't have to be masked off (even easier with a wood deck). The downside to this is that all of those little doo-dads have to be prepared and painted separately...

My personal way of doing things is to clean up as much as I can on the sprue, paint, remove, clean and paint the sprue attachment point, mount to model. Sometimes I remove and clean the parts, and put them on two-sided tape, then paint. But with this kit, there's just so much stuff (that's a good thing!) that I was afraid I'd lose something. So here we are.


Here's everything...




Some detail shots...




A closeup of stuff like ammo boxes, binoculars, 25mm singles, etc. There are two sprues like this. I was kinda dumb with Part 18 (top parts). I should have removed the plastic nub between the parts, but this thought completely escaped me until after I painted them (I was in the "Clean Up Zone" and working mechanically). The 25's will receive their gun metal finish after removal (their pedestals are painted gray).




Another update in a few days with the long awaited deck sealing and wash tutorial! Be there or be square!
blaster76
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Posted: Tuesday, October 21, 2008 - 04:38 AM GMT+7
Dade I'm just wondering if painting a liquid laquer flat (Testor's) on the wood would have the same effect. I'm pretty much going to mimic what you do when I do mine.

Are you planning on getting the Akagi? I saw that nice price GM is selling it for and am sorely tempted to get the kit. I might wait 6 more months after that to order the underside maze stuff (probably after you do it if you get the kit and do a build log on it )
Karybdis
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Posted: Tuesday, October 21, 2008 - 10:59 AM GMT+7
Howdy Steve,

That sounds like a good idea with the lacquer. But since I'm going to put a wash on the deck, I'll want a smooth, shiny surface for the wash to flow better, so I'll stick with the sealer- wash- dull coat idea. Still, for those who don't want a wash, the lacquer could work pretty well.

I change my mind about the Akagi everyday. Mostly I think about how I don't really have the time and how I should really get my docket cleared a little more. But then I see that price and that underside PE (you know what a PE junkie I am) and think, "Hmmm, maybe..." I've kinda settled on the idea that if given the kit and PE for an official build log (like this one), I'll build her... but if I buy everything myself, I'll wait a while. Of course, I may change my mind about that tomorrow.

Alrighty, off to my dad's for a few days. The deck prep report when I get back.
Gunny
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Posted: Tuesday, October 21, 2008 - 11:29 AM GMT+7

Quoted Text


I change my mind about the Akagi everyday. Mostly I think about how I don't really have the time and how I should really get my docket cleared a little more. But then I see that price and that underside PE (you know what a PE junkie I am) and think, "Hmmm, maybe..." I've kinda settled on the idea that if given the kit and PE for an official build log (like this one), I'll build her... but if I buy everything myself, I'll wait a while. Of course, I may change my mind about that tomorrow.



WELL, now, Mr. Bell....we'll just have to see about that, my friend... If our friends grace us with the kit, It'll be heading your way........
~Gunny
goldenpony
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Posted: Tuesday, October 21, 2008 - 01:47 PM GMT+7
Even though everyone else has already said it I will too, great job!

blaster76
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Posted: Tuesday, October 21, 2008 - 02:11 PM GMT+7
Oh Mark, I am jealous !!!!!!!!!!!!!! HOwever if you do get the kit and PE and Dade doesn't want it, I'm your man. If you get the PE set only, pop it to me. I am more than likely going to get the Akagi. I've got the ISE on pre-order and if I get the Akagi, that will eliminate the Repulse and Prinz Eugen, but I think those wil be around for a whie and I can probably pick them up on ebay in 8 or 9 months at a good discount. I plan to start my Kongo build in January by then Dade should have his done and I will have all the trial and error reports laid out in front of me. So for now, I'm pretty much playing with Armor kits
Karybdis
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Posted: Friday, October 24, 2008 - 01:23 AM GMT+7
Hey guys,

I just got back from my out of town at my dad's where we sealed the deck. It all went beautifully and looks great. Now I have to put on the wash and dull coat, so I hope to have that posted by Sunday.

A big and painful monkey wrench was thrown in the works when on Tuesday I had to get rushed to the ER by ambulance because of a 6mm (1/4") kidney stone. It's the only kidney stone I've ever had and the pain was excruciating and my vision was blurring. I'll spare the details, but long story short, the doctors all agreed that I should try to see if it'll pass on its own before surgery, so I've got some major pain meds until then. Because of the uncertain nature of all this, I'll try my best to stay on target with my updates but if I fall behind a few days, I hope you'll forgive me.

So anyway, if all goes according to plan, the big deck tutorial is coming Sunday.

And Mark, you got a deal, boss! You are the man!
Clanky44
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Posted: Friday, October 24, 2008 - 06:55 AM GMT+7
Hi Dade,

OUCH!! That's gotta hurt!! Hopefully it'll pass without too much pain.

Good luck!

Frank

P.S. I look forward to seeing your Akagi build in the future.
skipper
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Posted: Friday, October 24, 2008 - 08:21 AM GMT+7
Hi Dade!!!

Trow your stone away (6mm????? Ouch!!)
When good, get back to the bench
Get well soon


Rui
Karybdis
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Posted: Friday, October 24, 2008 - 12:47 PM GMT+7
Thanks for the well-wishes guys. I need 'em!

BTW, Gakken has released a newer book on the Kongo, #65. Mine is on the way from HLJ. Here's the link:

http://www.hlj.com/product/GAKPW-65

Now you don't have to deal with those insane prices people are getting on ebay for the original release ($75????).
#027
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Posted: Friday, October 24, 2008 - 02:21 PM GMT+7
Looking good Dade!


Kenny
Gunny
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Posted: Saturday, October 25, 2008 - 07:45 AM GMT+7

Quoted Text

Hey guys,

I just got back from my out of town at my dad's where we sealed the deck. It all went beautifully and looks great. Now I have to put on the wash and dull coat, so I hope to have that posted by Sunday.

A big and painful monkey wrench was thrown in the works when on Tuesday I had to get rushed to the ER by ambulance because of a 6mm (1/4") kidney stone. It's the only kidney stone I've ever had and the pain was excruciating and my vision was blurring. I'll spare the details, but long story short, the doctors all agreed that I should try to see if it'll pass on its own before surgery, so I've got some major pain meds until then. Because of the uncertain nature of all this, I'll try my best to stay on target with my updates but if I fall behind a few days, I hope you'll forgive me.

So anyway, if all goes according to plan, the big deck tutorial is coming Sunday.

And Mark, you got a deal, boss! You are the man!



Oh Mr. Bell, I too am a stone sufferer of long, mate, and I'll tell ya what...if you can pass that 6mm stone (BIG jagged rock, VERY small passages! ) you'll really impress this old dawg...I do believe an ultrasound smashing is on the slate for you, my friend (painless, with immediate relief)...just take it easy till you can see straight again, Dade!
~Mark
Dr_Who2
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Posted: Saturday, October 25, 2008 - 07:40 PM GMT+7
Hi Dade,

Sorry to hear what happened.
Give it the time needed.

IŽll include you into my prayers so you get well faster than one can count from 1 - 3.

My best well wishing
Karybdis
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Posted: Sunday, October 26, 2008 - 04:54 PM GMT+7
Hi Mark and DT, thanks for the kind words and well wishes. They always mean a lot.


Here are the steps for preparing the Kongo's deck.

As explained in previous installments, I like to seal thin wood products for three reasons:
1.) To keep the wood from getting mold, discoloration, or cracking over the years.
2.) To protect it from the adhesive used to glue it on to the ship.
3.) To keep the wash from soaking into the wood and allowing it to only bring out the engraved details.

We tried a bunch of different sealing items and came down to three: Sherwin Williams Sanding Sealer (brush on), Tamiya gloss clear coat spray (!), Valspar Premium Enamel. Out of the three, the Valspar turned out the best for staying close to the original wood color. Here is a photo with the three in comparison on a scrap piece of wood. In the photo, the Valspar looks close to the Tamiya (middle), but in real life, worked much better at staying true to the deck color.



While I would have preferred a gloss seal, the satin seal ended up working well for my process.


The pieces were taped down on a very low adhesion tape to minimize curling and blowing away from the spray. The tape is low adhesion to keep the deck from getting destroyed on removal.




After the deck is sealed, it's time for the wash. I like to use a water based product called The Detailer, black. There is also a brown color that is useful for bringing out different effects (as seen on my Mikasa deck), but with this deck being made of wood, I really only needed one wash color. The Detailer can be lightened by simply thinning it out with water.

The Detailer is applied over the surface and after it's allowed to dry, it can be wiped off the top surface with a damp Q-Tip, leaving the darker wash in between the planks- the right area of the deck shown here has had the Detailer removal begun on the right side...




Wipe off enough to make the deck and crevices the shade you want it to be. Since this kit depicts the Kongo as she appeared in the Battle off Samar, the deck will be a little grubbier from all of her constant firing at those pesky destroyers of Taffy 3. So I've left a few darker spots here and there.

The top picture is with the Detailer applied, the bottom is with the excess wiped off.




After getting the deck to how I wanted it, a coat of Tamiya dull coat spray is put on to seal it all in and make everything nice and flat. Compare this picture with the earlier picture of the decks being sealed. Note how much more visible the planking is in this picture...





It's very hard to capture the subtle differences between wood with the wash and without, but this picture shows it fairly well. The piece of wood in the top right is the spare square that came with the deck. It has been sealed, but no wash applied. A close look shows the planks on the washed wood "popping" a little more, along with some of the darkening from all of the gun fire and smoke. This effect is more visible in real life.




That's it for deck preparation. The next step is gluing the deck to the model, but first I have to put a wash and dull coat on the hull. More to come when that process is complete.
blaster76
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Posted: Sunday, October 26, 2008 - 07:02 PM GMT+7
I hereby make it a requirement that when you use a non-standard product like the Valspar and blackening stuff you tell us where to get it and how much.

Seriously though, I'ld like to get both the products, I've got brush on enamel dull coat I could substitue, but that blackening stuff looks like gold.

I plan to use Gator glue to glue onto deck, but am very interested if you have something else.
Karybdis
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Posted: Monday, October 27, 2008 - 10:40 AM GMT+7
Fair enough.

The Valspar came from Lowes, but I don't remember the price, because itwas part of my father's "collection". I don't think it would be too much, though, since it's just a spray can.

I bought the Detiler years ago at a local hobby shop (a couple bottles go a long way). Here's the company website:
http://thedetailer.net/

I'll be using white glue to glue the deck down, but I'll also give some spray adhesive a shot. I'll report back on what I ended up preferring...
skipper
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Posted: Monday, October 27, 2008 - 11:17 AM GMT+7
Hi Dade!

The deck looks good! The wash really helps enhance the details, that otherwise would be missed.
This is what I want to make on the Akagi triple deck wood parts, with some care on using a thin varnish/sealer, since I don't want the small planking detail to disappear!

Keep up!

Rui

PS: Did you already trow your "stone" away? Hope so...
Karybdis
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Posted: Monday, October 27, 2008 - 12:56 PM GMT+7
Hi Rui,

If you use the Valspar spray sealer, the details will be safe as it sprays on very thin. I sealed the 1/700 Yamashiro deck at the same time as the Kongo's and all of the details and engravings were fine.

Unfortunately, this stupid stone is still with me, but thankfully the pain hasn't been as bad as when I had to go to the emergency room (it's mostly kidney pain now). I don't think I've ever drank so much water in my life to get the stone out. I hope it works. Thanks for the good thoughts.


Speaking of which, special thanks to Harry from BFM for the call the other day to check up on me.


Hey Mark, after the deck is glued on and the process is done, what do you think of making this portion of the log a feature to help out the rest of the gang who are getting into wood decks?
CaptSonghouse
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Posted: Monday, October 27, 2008 - 05:33 PM GMT+7

Quoted Text

Hi Mark and DT, thanks for the kind words and well wishes. They always mean a lot.


Here are the steps for preparing the Kongo's deck.

As explained in previous installments, I like to seal thin wood products for three reasons:
1.) To keep the wood from getting mold, discoloration, or cracking over the years.
2.) To protect it from the adhesive used to glue it on to the ship.
3.) To keep the wash from soaking into the wood and allowing it to only bring out the engraved details.

We tried a bunch of different sealing items and came down to three: Sherwin Williams Sanding Sealer (brush on), Tamiya gloss clear coat spray (!), Valspar Premium Enamel. Out of the three, the Valspar turned out the best for staying close to the original wood color. Here is a photo with the three in comparison on a scrap piece of wood. In the photo, the Valspar looks close to the Tamiya (middle), but in real life, worked much better at staying true to the deck color.



While I would have preferred a gloss seal, the satin seal ended up working well for my process.


The pieces were taped down on a very low adhesion tape to minimize curling and blowing away from the spray. The tape is low adhesion to keep the deck from getting destroyed on removal.




After the deck is sealed, it's time for the wash. I like to use a water based product called The Detailer, black. There is also a brown color that is useful for bringing out different effects (as seen on my Mikasa deck), but with this deck being made of wood, I really only needed one wash color. The Detailer can be lightened by simply thinning it out with water.

The Detailer is applied over the surface and after it's allowed to dry, it can be wiped off the top surface with a damp Q-Tip, leaving the darker wash in between the planks- the right area of the deck shown here has had the Detailer removal begun on the right side...




Wipe off enough to make the deck and crevices the shade you want it to be. Since this kit depicts the Kongo as she appeared in the Battle off Samar, the deck will be a little grubbier from all of her constant firing at those pesky destroyers of Taffy 3. So I've left a few darker spots here and there.

The top picture is with the Detailer applied, the bottom is with the excess wiped off.




After getting the deck to how I wanted it, a coat of Tamiya dull coat spray is put on to seal it all in and make everything nice and flat. Compare this picture with the earlier picture of the decks being sealed. Note how much more visible the planking is in this picture...




It's very hard to capture the subtle differences between wood with the wash and without, but this picture shows it fairly well. The piece of wood in the top right is the spare square that came with the deck. It has been sealed, but no wash applied. A close look shows the planks on the washed wood "popping" a little more, along with some of the darkening from all of the gun fire and smoke. This effect is more visible in real life.




That's it for deck preparation. The next step is gluing the deck to the model, but first I have to put a wash and dull coat on the hull. More to come when that process is complete.



Wow, Dade, those decks look like they've already seen a lot of sea time!

--Karl
blaster76
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Posted: Tuesday, October 28, 2008 - 01:40 PM GMT+7
Thnks for the website. I ordered 4 bottles of the stuff. 2 black a brown and a grey. I'll check Lowes on he way home from work THurs .

Oh, I did a small kidney stone a few years ago. Weird night. My ex came blazing in becasue her cell phone had been cut off, she had made a minimal payment a few hours earlier but they hadn't reactivated. So she comes by my house to call and scream at them. Her buddy needed to pick up her kids by a certain time or could not see them for a week. The ex was not tuned in to her girlfriends desperation who just took the car and left to take care of it. About 10 minutes later Tracy solved the phone problem only to deiscover car missing. She started to call police which I advised not to do as car would end up in impound lot. Of course Tracy is screeching and i'm yelling. Buddy calls in and the yelling is getting loud. All I want is for everyone to go becasue I am in pain passing this small stone. The cops show up (courtesy of a nosy neighbor)and push their way into the house and are investigating. Me I'm wanting everyone out and with BOZO-COP there it ain't happening. Trac thought I was nuts when I began yelling at him too. End of story got everyone out, passed stone that night and everyone was fine the next day.
#027
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Posted: Tuesday, October 28, 2008 - 02:00 PM GMT+7
Very nice work Dade! Makes me wish there was a wood deck for my 1/700 Iron Duke.

Kenny
Dr_Who2
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Posted: Wednesday, October 29, 2008 - 04:16 PM GMT+7
Hi Dade,

Thank you for the detailed and founded information about how you treated the wood decks. The information is invaluable by any means.

I have some wood decks here arround and never figured how to enhance the wood structure without messing the over all look. Your solution looks like a perfect winner .

IŽll have to figure a way to obtain the Valspar enamel clear satin though.

I do have Future at avail but am unsure what will happen if applied.
Those wood pieces are way too expensive to fool arround with.

Again, really nice work with an A+ reasoning.
Karybdis
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Posted: Wednesday, October 29, 2008 - 04:32 PM GMT+7
Hi guys,

Thanks as always for the kind words! Well, I have to put the project on hold for a few days because I thought I had more dull coat than I did. I'm all out now, so I have to wait for my order of more to arrive before I can finish the deck mounting process. Geez, I pride myself on always having readily available materials, so I don't know how this slipped by me. Ah well, I need to get some work done on the Hiryu this month anyway... So more in a few days when more dull coat arrives.

Kenny, thanks! Shinsengumi is coming out with some generic waterslide sheets of decking that you can cut to shape. It's not real wood, but I may give one a shot sometime to see how it looks...

Steve, that's quite a story! Thankfully, I didn't have to go through anything like that. The ambulance ride (my first) was stressful enough! You can't go wrong with those colors of Detailer. Maybe grab a brown and an orange (makes good rust stains) sometime too.

DT, I'm glad I could help out. You can check out Valspar's web site for more information about maybe ordering it, or perhaps do some tests with enamel based wood sealers available near you. The main thing is to keep away from water based solutions both for the thin wood and it may interfere with a water based wash and to keep the sealant thin and as close to the original wood color as possible. So many darken the wood color even though they claim not to...

Okay gang, more on the way when my dull coat reserves are replenished.